DynoSim combinations
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| − | + | If you want an accurate estimate, techinspector1 has said the following is needed: | |
| − | * | + | '''DYNOSIM REQUIRED DATA''' |
| + | *Bore | ||
| + | *Stroke | ||
| + | *Rod Length | ||
| + | *Cylinder head flow, intake and exhaust 0.100" through 0.700" or whatever the mfg gives for range | ||
| + | *Intake valve diameter | ||
| + | *Exhaust valve diameter | ||
| + | *Static compression ratio | ||
| + | *CFM, type of induction (2-bbl, 4-bbl, TBI, TPI) | ||
| + | *Intake manifold type, mfg (single 4-bbl, two 4-bbl, one 2-bbl, three 2-bbl, individual runner Weber, mechanical fuel injection, low-rise, high-rise, tunnel ram, dual-plane, single-plane, part no. if you have it. | ||
| + | *Exhaust system (be specific, primary tube size if long-tube headers). | ||
| + | *Camshaft | ||
| + | **Part number, grind number. | ||
| + | **Type (flat, roller, solid, hyd.). | ||
| + | **Intake valve lift, exhaust valve lift. | ||
| + | **Timing info and at what tappet lift the info is valid, i.e. 0.006", 0.050", etc. | ||
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| − | + | ==='''The following will show horsepower and torque results using different combinations of parts'''=== | |
| − | + | OK, first things first. I have to agree that the DynoSim results sometimes seem optimistic, but consider this. The software is configured with the premise that the hard parts will be tweaked by the builder, the build dimensions will be blueprinted to the loose side and the final tuning will be spot-on. There's an old saying in hot rodderdom, "Loose is fast". | |
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| + | And when I run a sim, I change things around considerably to get to the final figures. It will take me an hour or better to do it properly on just one motor. You may have seen, sometimes I will include verbage like "tried 6 different cams, retarded 'em, advanced em', 3 different manifolds, 4 different static compression ratios, etc." Just changing the cam requires runnin it straight up, advancing 2 degrees, then 4 degrees, then retarding it 2 degrees, then 4 degrees. So I have 5 different sets of figures just for 1 cam. Do that with 6 different cams and you have 30 sets of numbers.....just for the cam. | ||
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| + | Now, multiply that times different manifolds, different static compression ratios, etc. and you can see where it is a time-consuming task to sim a motor. But that's who I am. If I can't do it right, I won't do it at all. You can rest assured that when I post a sim, the motor has been tweaked to within an inch of its life. It's as good as it's gonna get with the parts used. Use different parts and you will get a lesser result. Anyway, that's probably why some fellows question my numbers, because they've never done what I've done with the software. Most people don't have the time or patience to do it the way I do, but I'm retired, have the time and patience and like nothing better than to start with a clean sheet of paper and "build" a motor. | ||
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| + | I have checked the results I get against real dyno pulls and this DynoSim has shown to be within 2% of real. Not bad in my opinion. I'm seriously considering upgrading to DynoSim5 and an add-on cam file. I have 800 cam files now, but the add-on would give me 6000 files. I was dragged kicking and screaming into the computer age, but I'll tell you, there's nothing any more fun than dinkin' on this thing. Well.....there was that time in New Orleans, but that's a whole 'nuther story... | ||
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| + | '''355 Gen I Chevy street motor, 453 HP, 475 ft-lbs torque.''' | ||
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*Block: '68-'86 Chevy 350 Gen I bored +0.030". | *Block: '68-'86 Chevy 350 Gen I bored +0.030". | ||
*Crank: Stock 350, 3.48" stroke, 2.450" main journal diameter. | *Crank: Stock 350, 3.48" stroke, 2.450" main journal diameter. | ||
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*Carburetor: Vacuum secondaries 750 CFM. | *Carburetor: Vacuum secondaries 750 CFM. | ||
*Headers: 1 3/4" primaries, long-tube, equal-length. Install "X" pipe between collectors and mufflers. Run 2 1/2" pipe to the rear through mufflers of your choice. | *Headers: 1 3/4" primaries, long-tube, equal-length. Install "X" pipe between collectors and mufflers. Run 2 1/2" pipe to the rear through mufflers of your choice. | ||
| − | *Camshaft: CompCams flat tappet hydraulic 260H | + | *Camshaft: CompCams flat tappet hydraulic 260H: [http://www.compcams.com/Cam_Specs/CamDetails.aspx?csid=72&sb=0], installed straight up. |
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*Rocker Arms: 1.6 ratio on both intake and exhaust. | *Rocker Arms: 1.6 ratio on both intake and exhaust. | ||
*Static Compression Ratio: 9.6:1 | *Static Compression Ratio: 9.6:1 | ||
*Dynamic Compression Ratio: 8.4:1 | *Dynamic Compression Ratio: 8.4:1 | ||
*Squish: 0.035" to 0.045". Zero piston deck height with 0.035" to 0.045" head gasket or 0.010" to 0.020" piston deck height with Victor Reinz #5746 head gasket that compresses to 0.025". | *Squish: 0.035" to 0.045". Zero piston deck height with 0.035" to 0.045" head gasket or 0.010" to 0.020" piston deck height with Victor Reinz #5746 head gasket that compresses to 0.025". | ||
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| + | :'''RPM HP TQ''' | ||
*1000 59 310 | *1000 59 310 | ||
*1500 103 361 | *1500 103 361 | ||
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*5500 453 433 | *5500 453 433 | ||
*6000 450 394 | *6000 450 394 | ||
| − | + | Stock converter and stock rear gear will work, but would be more fun with a converter that stalls at 2000 to 2200 rpm's and a 3.73 gear. The most out-of-whack spec on this build is the fact that RHS flows their heads on a 4.200" pipe. The resulting flow numbers bear little resemblance to real-life flow on a 4.030" cylinder bore. If you want closer to real, multiply these hp/torque figures by 0.95. | |
| − | + | '''383 Gen I street motor. 485 hp, 496 ft-lbs torque.''' | |
| − | + | OK, staying with the RHS heads, but using the Pro Action 180's and reducing the advertised flow by 5% to get closer to real, flow used for this build on a 383 will be as follows: | |
| + | |||
| + | :'''LIFT INT EXH | ||
*.100 70 55 | *.100 70 55 | ||
*.200 143 96 | *.200 143 96 | ||
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*.600 250 181 | *.600 250 181 | ||
*.700 257 185 | *.700 257 185 | ||
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*We'll bore a 350 block +0.030" and use a 3.750" stroke crank and 5.7" rods. Scat makes a cast STEEL crank and capscrew I-beam rods that will work here. If you want to use a 4.040" or 4.060" bore, that's OK too. 4.060" will make a 388 motor. | *We'll bore a 350 block +0.030" and use a 3.750" stroke crank and 5.7" rods. Scat makes a cast STEEL crank and capscrew I-beam rods that will work here. If you want to use a 4.040" or 4.060" bore, that's OK too. 4.060" will make a 388 motor. | ||
*Heads: Racing Head Service Pro Action 180, 72cc chambers, 2.02" intake, 1.60" exhaust. | *Heads: Racing Head Service Pro Action 180, 72cc chambers, 2.02" intake, 1.60" exhaust. | ||
*Pistons: Keith Black hypereutectic #KB134, 7cc flat-top, 5/64/5/64/3/16 rings, 1.433 compression height. | *Pistons: Keith Black hypereutectic #KB134, 7cc flat-top, 5/64/5/64/3/16 rings, 1.433 compression height. | ||
*Intake manifold: Dual-plane, high-rise such as the Edelbrock RPM, Weiand Stealth or Professional Products Typhoon. | *Intake manifold: Dual-plane, high-rise such as the Edelbrock RPM, Weiand Stealth or Professional Products Typhoon. | ||
| − | *Carburetor: Vacuum secondaries 850 | + | *Carburetor: Vacuum secondaries 850. |
*Headers: 1 3/4" primaries, long-tube, equal-length. Install "X" pipe between collectors and mufflers. Run 2 1/2" to 2 3/4" pipe to the rear through mufflers of your choice. | *Headers: 1 3/4" primaries, long-tube, equal-length. Install "X" pipe between collectors and mufflers. Run 2 1/2" to 2 3/4" pipe to the rear through mufflers of your choice. | ||
| − | *Camshaft: Compcams hydraulic flat tappet, installed 2 degrees retarded | + | *Camshaft: Compcams hydraulic flat tappet, installed 2 degrees retarded: [http://www.compcams.com/Cam_Specs/CamDetails.aspx?csid=79&sb=0]. |
| − | + | *Rocker arms: 1.6, lift at valve 0.512". | |
| − | *Rocker arms: 1.6, lift at valve 0.512" | + | *Static compression ratio: 10.0:1. |
| − | *Static compression ratio: 10.0:1 | + | *Dynamic compression ratio: 8.2:1. |
| − | *Dynamic compression ratio: 8.2:1 | + | |
| − | + | :'''RPM HP TQ''' | |
*2000 148 389 | *2000 148 389 | ||
*2500 188 395 | *2500 188 395 | ||
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| − | + | '''383, 505 hp, 500 ft-lbs torque. Same motor as above with solid, flat tappet cam: [http://www.compcams.com/Cam_Specs/CamDetails.aspx?csid=238&sb=0], 1.5 rockers.''' | |
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| − | + | :'''RPM HP TQ''' | |
*2000 145 382 | *2000 145 382 | ||
*2500 185 390 | *2500 185 390 | ||
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| − | *Bore the block 0.030", use these or other 12cc pistons w/5.7 rods | + | '''355, L31 heads, flat tappet hydraulic cam, stock rail rockers, some head work for better springs.''' |
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| + | In this build, I would be interested in spending the least amount of money as suggested by the OP. In that vein, I would use stock rail rockers. Lift is under a half inch, so I would think the rr would be OK. Since I'm not sure that all locks locate the valve tip the same, relative to the top of the retainer, I would welcome input from others about using a (-0.050") lock (that's what's listed above.) to insure the valve tip sticks up far enough above the retainer so that the retainer top surface doesn't get loaded by the side rails of the rail rockers. | ||
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| + | *Bore the block 0.030", use these or other 12cc pistons w/5.7 rods: [http://www.kb-silvolite.com/test/kb_car/performance.php?action=details&P_id=155]. | ||
*Makes 9.6:1 static compression ratio. Cut block decks to zero and use a 0.040" head gasket. | *Makes 9.6:1 static compression ratio. Cut block decks to zero and use a 0.040" head gasket. | ||
| − | *Use XE274H Comp cam installed at | + | *Use XE274H Comp cam (Cam card: [http://www.compcams.com/Cam_Specs/CamDetails.aspx?csid=87&sb=0]), installed at straight up. |
| − | + | *Comp 981 valve springs/ 750-16 retainers/ 630-16 keepers and stock 1.5 rail rockers. 1.250" springs should be OK because the cam is a moderate grind, hydraulic flat tappet. | |
| − | *Performance Distributors 12720 HEI, custom curved | + | *Narrow the O.D. of the guides to less than the I.D. of the damper spring and cut for PC-type positive seals. |
| − | + | *Cut top of guide for 0.550" play from bottom of retainer to top of *guide seal. Pin the pressed-in rocker studs with this kit: [http://www.summitracing.com/parts/MRG-806G?autofilter=1&part=MRG-806G&N=700+4294746236+115&autoview=sku]. | |
| − | + | *Performance Distributors 12720 HEI, custom curved: [http://www.performancedistributors.com/gmssdui.htm] | |
| − | + | *Edelbrock RPM Vortec intake mounting a 750 vacuum secondary carb of your choice. Edelbrock, Rochester 5 psi max at the inlet, Holley *6 psi max at the inlet. | |
| − | *Edelbrock RPM Vortec intake mounting a 750 vacuum | + | *Performer RPM Vortec w/natural finish: #7116, w/EnduraShine finish: #71164, w/polished finish: #71161 '''-OR-''' |
| − | *Performer RPM Vortec #7116 | + | *Look for a used manifold on craigslist to save a few shekels. |
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| − | *Look for a used manifold on craigslist to save a few | + | |
*Long-tube 1 5/8" headers with X or H pipe right after the collectors, 2 1/2"/2 3/4" pipes to the rear through mufflers of your choice. | *Long-tube 1 5/8" headers with X or H pipe right after the collectors, 2 1/2"/2 3/4" pipes to the rear through mufflers of your choice. | ||
| − | *Use 2500 stall converter, shorter rear gears. | + | *Use 2500 stall converter, shorter rear gears. |
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| + | :'''RPM HP TQ''' | ||
*2000 138 364 | *2000 138 364 | ||
*2500 176 369 | *2500 176 369 | ||
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*5500 405 386 | *5500 405 386 | ||
*6000 375 328 | *6000 375 328 | ||
| − | *Peak dynamic compression ratio 8.16:1 on KB's calculator. | + | **Peak dynamic compression ratio 8.16:1 on KB's calculator. |
| − | *Peak volumetric efficiency 97.2% @5000 | + | **Peak volumetric efficiency 97.2% @5000 |
| − | *Peak BMEP 184.5 @4000 | + | **Peak BMEP 184.5 @4000 |
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| − | *KB106-030 pistons, flat-top, 7cc's, 1.561" CH | + | |
| − | + | '''350 WITH TWO FOUR BARRELS''' | |
| − | *Edelbrock E-Street heads, #5073, 185cc intake runners, 70cc chambers, 9.53:1 SCR. Published flow was factored by 0.95 for this | + | *KB106-030 pistons, flat-top, 7cc's, 1.561" CH: [http://www.kb-silvolite.com/kb_car/...php?action=comp] |
| − | + | *Edelbrock E-Street heads, #5073, 185cc intake runners, 70cc chambers: [http://www.summitracing.com/parts/EDL-5073/], 9.53:1 SCR. Published flow was factored by 0.95 for this exercise. | |
| − | *High leak-down rate flat tappet hyd lifters such as Crane 99377-16 Hi Intensity Hydraulic Lifters because we are going to use "too | + | *High leak-down rate flat tappet hyd lifters such as Crane 99377-16 Hi Intensity Hydraulic Lifters because we are going to use "too much" cam for the SCR. These lifters will reduce duration by 6-10 degrees under 3000 rpm's for better bottom end torque figures. |
| − | *Crane Saturday Night Special 110591 flat tappet hyd cam | + | *Crane Saturday Night Special #110591 flat tappet hyd cam: [http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CRN-110591/], installed 2 degrees retarded. |
| − | + | *With pistons at 1.561", rods at 5.703" and crank radius at 1.740", the stack measures 9.004", so with a nominal 9.025" block deck height, you would need to make a cut of 0.021" to get to zero deck. | |
| − | *With pistons at 1.561", rods at 5.703" and crank radius at 1.740", the stack measures 9.004", so with a nominal 9.025" block deck | + | *A 0.040" compressed gasket would then put the squish at 0.040". |
| − | *1 5/8" long tube headers | + | *1 5/8" long tube headers. |
*Edelbrock 2-4 RPM intake manifold mounting two 500's. | *Edelbrock 2-4 RPM intake manifold mounting two 500's. | ||
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| + | :'''RPM HP TQ''' | ||
*2000 145 381 | *2000 145 381 | ||
*2500 184 387 | *2500 184 387 | ||
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*5500 420 402 | *5500 420 402 | ||
*6000 400 349 | *6000 400 349 | ||
| − | *Peak volumetric efficiency 92.1% @5000 | + | **Peak volumetric efficiency 92.1% @5000 |
| − | *Peak BMEP 187.8 @4000 | + | **Peak BMEP 187.8 @4000 |
| − | *This motor should be waaaaaay fun with a 4-speed or auto with a loose converter. | + | **This motor should be waaaaaay fun with a 4-speed or auto with a loose converter. |
| − | This would be my recipe for a street/strip truck motor. | + | |
| − | 400 block bored 0.030" and zero decked to the piston crowns, align honed main bearing bore. | + | |
| − | Scat 9-400-3750-5700 cast steel Pro Comp crankshaft | + | '''This would be my recipe for a street/strip truck motor.''' |
| − | + | *400 block bored 0.030" and zero decked to the piston crowns, align honed main bearing bore. | |
| − | *Scat Forged I-beam 5.7" rods | + | *Scat #9-400-3750-5700 cast steel Pro Comp crankshaft: [http://www.race-mart.com/Scat_Manuf...-3750-5700.html]. |
| − | + | *Scat Forged I-beam 5.7" rods: [http://www.race-mart.com/Scat_Manuf...2-ICR5700P.html]. | |
| − | *Keith Black hypereutectic pistons 22cc dish to make 9.8:1 static compression ratio with 64cc heads | + | *Keith Black #UEM-KB168-030 hypereutectic pistons 22cc dish to make 9.8:1 static compression ratio with 64cc heads: [http://www.summitracing.com/parts/UEM-KB168-030]. |
| − | + | *CompCams #CCA-12-430-8 retro-fit hydraulic roller cam installed 2 degrees retarded: [http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CCA-12-430-8/]. | |
| − | *CompCams retro-fit hydraulic roller cam installed 2 degrees retarded | + | *Howard's retro-fit hydraulic roller lifters: [http://www.summitracing.com/parts/HRS-91164N/]. |
| − | + | *CompCams #CCA-200 thrust button: [http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CCA-200/]. | |
| − | *Howard's retro-fit hydraulic roller lifters | + | *CompCams #CCA-201 wear plate: [http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CCA-201/]. |
| − | + | *Edelbrock #EDL-7101 RPM intake manifold: [http://www.summitracing.com/parts/EDL-7101/]. | |
| − | *CompCams thrust button | + | *Dart Iron Eagle Platinum 215 cast iron heads #DRT-10521123P: [http://www.summitracing.com/parts/DRT-10521123P/] (price shown is for one head). |
| − | + | *Barry Grant Speed Demon 750: [http://www.amazon.com/Barry-Grant-1...r/dp/B000CIN32M] (BG is now defunct, so a similar carb would be substituted). | |
| − | *CompCams wear plate | + | *Jegs air filter base: [http://www.jegs.com/i/JEGS/555/5003...roductId=751908] Run a hose from the base to your PCV valve. |
| − | + | *Jegs air filter lid: [http://www.jegs.com/i/JEGS/555/5003...roductId=751908]. | |
| − | *Edelbrock RPM intake manifold | + | *14" x 4" paper element: [http://www.shopping.com/Allstar-ALL...4hO3SNWw==/info]. Snag the correct length stud and a wing nut from your local Ace Hardware. |
| − | + | *Hedman Elite headers, 1 3/4" primaries: [http://www.summitracing.com/parts/HED-69088]. | |
| − | *Dart Iron Eagle Platinum 215 cast iron heads | + | |
| − | + | :'''RPM HP TQ''' | |
| − | *Barry Grant Speed Demon 750 | + | |
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| − | *Jegs air filter base | + | |
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| − | *Jegs air filter lid | + | |
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| − | *14" x 4" paper element | + | |
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| − | *Hedman Elite headers, 1 3/4" primaries | + | |
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*2000 154 405 | *2000 154 405 | ||
*2500 195 410 | *2500 195 410 | ||
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Run a nylon or copper line from the carburetor inlet back to the firewall and up past the hood lip to the cowl of the truck. On the cowl, temporarily mount a mechanical fuel pressure gauge (0-15 psi) so that you can view it through the windshield as you drive. Regulate fuel pressure down to 5-5 1/2 psi. If you have too much fuel pressure, it will blow past the needle and seat in the bowl and into the intake manifold as raw fuel. This will cause you untold tuning nightmares, so get this under control first thing. DO NOT TAKE ANYBODY'S WORD FOR THE AMOUNT OF PRESSURE THEIR PUMP PUTS OUT. MONITOR THE GAUGE AND CHECK IT YOURSELF OR SUFFER THE CONSEQUENCES. | Run a nylon or copper line from the carburetor inlet back to the firewall and up past the hood lip to the cowl of the truck. On the cowl, temporarily mount a mechanical fuel pressure gauge (0-15 psi) so that you can view it through the windshield as you drive. Regulate fuel pressure down to 5-5 1/2 psi. If you have too much fuel pressure, it will blow past the needle and seat in the bowl and into the intake manifold as raw fuel. This will cause you untold tuning nightmares, so get this under control first thing. DO NOT TAKE ANYBODY'S WORD FOR THE AMOUNT OF PRESSURE THEIR PUMP PUTS OUT. MONITOR THE GAUGE AND CHECK IT YOURSELF OR SUFFER THE CONSEQUENCES. | ||
| − | The 400 block will require that you drill steam holes in the heads. Any manufacturer you buy from will drill them for you before they ship the heads to you. Install the heads with a head gasket that is designed for installation on a 400 block because the gaskets will also have steam holes in them from the manufacturer. Here is the procedure in the event you want to know how to do it | + | The 400 block will require that you drill steam holes in the heads. Any manufacturer you buy from will drill them for you before they ship the heads to you. Install the heads with a head gasket that is designed for installation on a 400 block because the gaskets will also have steam holes in them from the manufacturer. Here is the procedure in the event you want to know how to do it: [http://www.gregsengine.com/converti...ads-to-400.html]. |
| − | http://www.gregsengine.com/converti...ads-to-400.html | + | |
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| + | Use a composition gasket that compresses to 0.039" to 0.041". With the zero deck of the block, this will put the piston crown at 0.039" to 0.041" from the underside of the cylinder head with the piston at TDC. This establishes your "squish" dimension at 0.039" to 0.041", which will optimize the motor for detonation-free operation on pump gas. | ||
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| − | *RPM HP TQ | + | |
| + | '''Here's one I put together for a nice little street cruiser motor running on cheapo pump gas.''' | ||
| + | I might be thinkin': | ||
| + | *375-400 horsepower, 425+ lbs/ft of torque with 9.0:1 static compression ratio. | ||
| + | *Stock converter | ||
| + | *Mild cam (204-212 intake duration @0.050", 110 LSA) | ||
| + | *RPM intake | ||
| + | *750 carb | ||
| + | *1 5/8" long-tube headers | ||
| + | *3.50 rear gear. | ||
| + | Just a real nice cruiser. | ||
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| + | I really, really like these heads. They're inexpensive and they '''''work'''''. | ||
| + | *This is for one bare head: [http://www.competitionproducts.com/...tinfo/RHS12407/]. | ||
| + | *Then buy one valve kit (fills 2 heads): [http://www.competitionproducts.com/...oductinfo/8511/]. | ||
| + | *One guide plate kit (fills 2 heads): [http://www.competitionproducts.com/...ctinfo/42151-8/]. | ||
| + | *And one rocker stud kit (fills 2 heads): [http://www.competitionproducts.com/...tinfo/134-7101/]. | ||
| + | *Here's the cam (installed retarded 2 degrees): [http://www.summitracing.com/parts/HRS-110315-10/], | ||
| + | '''-OR-''' | ||
| + | [http://www.competitionproducts.com/...info/110315-10/]. | ||
| + | *And here are the roller lifters: [http://www.summitracing.com/parts/HRS-91164N/], | ||
| + | '''-OR-''' | ||
| + | [http://www.competitionproducts.com/...ductinfo/91164/]. | ||
| + | *Use a Howards composite distributor gear (will outlast a bronze gear 3 to 1): [http://www.competitionproducts.com/...ductinfo/94402/]. | ||
| + | |||
| + | :'''RPM HP TQ''' | ||
*2000 148 390 | *2000 148 390 | ||
*2500 188 395 | *2500 188 395 | ||
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*5500 400 382 | *5500 400 382 | ||
*6000 355 310 | *6000 355 310 | ||
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